🧑‍🔬 Weekly Witchy CHALLENGE - Science & Witchcraft

[Wysteria_Norn]

This was a well-presented and thought-provoking post.

As an aside, there’s a British TV program called Ghosts UK. On one of the episodes, the ghost of a paleolithic man is distraught when he cannot hold a ritual for ‘Moona’, the full moon. He goes on to wistfully explain that which many of us witches hold, (paraphrased) 'before man, there was moona." He continues that Moona lights the dark night, and is dependable in all ways, so that during and long after man ‘there is Moona.’

Your amazing pictures reminded me of that section of the show.
Thanks for your lovely post!

[Artemisia]

Thank you for the kind words @CelestiaMoon @Mystique @Kajsa

@celineelise

fibinachi spiral and sacred geometry,

Oh my goodness, how could I forget about this? Thank you for reminding me. I’m always fascinated by patterns and fractals in nature.

@Susurrus

that was a wonderful entry

You make me blush, thank you for that!

@Wysteria_Norn

I believe most of us witches and sorcerers would whole-heartedly agree!

Thank you! It’s another one of those topics that once I reflect on it, I realize just how profoundly it affects my practice. I’m surprised I hadn’t noticed it before!

[tracyS]

CHALLENGE ENTRY (death is mentioned)

I’m going to write this how I see how the magical world connects with the science world, from the viewpoint of spirit.

Magick was around before what we called science, though to the alchemists of old, they were scientists. The witches of old were advanced in medicine, for this they were persecuted to pave the way for modern medicine, only for us to now learn that the old medicine was infact advanced!

Today we have WiFi, phones that talk to other people on the other side of the world, in real time. We can send letters through cyberspace (emails/attachments), make moving pictures of things that don’t exist in our real world, fly in machines, break sound (Concorde), and land on the moon. These things are impossible, evil and the work of the devil 500 years ago, and such scientists would’ve been executed for even drawing up such plans. Yet here we are. I find it ironic that men of science laugh at witchcraft and magic as being impossible, yet not that long ago, their magick was impossible. It shows the shortsightedness of humans and the power of fear of what we can’t explain.

So what of spirit. For thousands of years, humans have had contact with something, be it ancestors, spirits, demons, gods etc, everytime in history humans have had contact. Are these entities endless, or is it the same group of entities that have visited each culture, each nation? Are these divine beings that visit us, entities from another realm in time and space? We just assign an identity to them, to fit with our culture?. Is Zeus Odin, Is Odin Yahweh, is Yahweh Brahman etc, you see where I’m going? Or are there myriads of myriads of entities, each pantheon a tribe of its own, from its own dimension that is attracted to a culture and educates that culture with it’s mysteries? Folding space as it were, to see us. Where is heaven, where is hell, where is Asgard? Wherever these places are, life travels from there to here, and has done throughout history, science can’t prove it, but it can’t disprove it either. Science is quick to believe in an ever self expanding universe, but is terrified of the thought of life beyond what they can explain. The mind boggles. All I am sure of is that they exist and they seem to want to interact with us.

And what of speaking to the dead? How do Psychics do it? The college of psychic studies, says that spirits love WiFi, they communicate through it so easily. Since WiFi they’ve had more and stronger connections with spirit. Spirit loves zoom. Does this mean that before we discovered WiFi, spirit had already been using it, to communicate to us, and now they’re thrilled we’ve finally caught up?
Spirit loves technology, how many experiences involving spirit saying hi, they flicker your electric lights, mess with your TV, or as Loki does put some of the worst country bumpkin music on my radio I’ve ever heard, changing my radio stations to ones I could never normally pickup, just for a laugh
And what of mediums and Psychics? What scientific forces are they using to hear, see and know what they know. For example:
How did my psychic know that my father in law would have a heart attack, 3 days before he did? (He was ok) . Or that I would get a scare about my mother’s health one month later but that I shouldn’t worry, cuz she would be fine? How did my grandmother, who was a psychic see her exact time, method of her death? What’s the science behind that? Are these Psychics subconsciously manipulating time to see this, are they crossing the veil which isn’t constrained by our time limitations, to get this info? Where are these spirits that talk to the mediums, is it so impossible to believe, really? We do this communication everyday through timezones everytime we dial a number from the UK to Australia and talk to someone (an impossible feat hundreds of years ago, try explaining how my mobile phone which has no wires, isn’t plugged into anything, is able to connect to someone through invisible cables to a citizen of Salem. It’s the devil’s work right?)

Wouldn’t it be wonderful if science could only remove it’s blinkers and remember what science is. The exploration of our world, the curiosity to ask the question, then the humility to acknowledge the answer even if it challenges our belief system, upturns the status quo and maybe causes a little fear.

I joke around about how in my practice of chaos Magick I just throw it all in and hope it doesn’t go boom! But it’s true. That’s what makes magic alive, the experiment. Yes, it will work but if it does go boom, oh well, don’t do that again But what fun eh! (Loki’s shaking his head in despair )

It is my belief that in the future, the Ouija board will be explained in physics classes, the medium will hold science seminars, and we will finally have made a Stargate and we can visit our entities in their world. Wouldn’t that be grand. But that will only be possible when science lets go of it’s fear, and embraces the unknown, weird and wonderful, and let the universe, gods, demons, dead etc show them their wonders.

[Kajsa]

Fabulous entry @tracyS! I love your energy You are totally correct and I believe it too…that will come to be

[Cosmic_Curiosity]

I totally agree with what you have said. It would be wonderful to see our practices as proven scientific fact. As i mentioned in my post, science was the go to for me because i (used to) love only fact, logic and evidence. However, science itself does not have all the answers…much of what it offers are simply theories and theories can be wrong. Because it cannot be proved doesnt mean it doesnt exist. I know that my deities exist because i have my own evidence…thats enough for me.

Gravity couldnt be proved at one point but there it was pulling apples to the ground. Our little ball of rock has always orbited the sun, but not according to the science of years gone by. It is just saddening that science is quick to dismiss something like magick when it has endured throught time, well after so many other ideas have been altered or dismissed entirely.
Wonderful post @tracyS i loved reading it

Blessed be

Alan

[tracyS]

@Kajsa and @Cosmic_Curiosity Aww Thankyou .

@Cosmic_Curiosity

I know that my deities exist because i have my own evidence…thats enough for me

Ditto. I think the deities probably role their eyes at us humans, we can be slow on the up take but when we finally get there, we’ll fly.

[Satans_Helper]

Challenge entry

When I think of magick I think of misunderstood things. Things that most choose not to see or are blind to that have been around forever. When I think of magick I think of the unknown and miracles.

When I think of science I think of things that can be proven and are palpable. Also I think of magick when I think of science. Science can be very magical and coming into knowing. I think of miracles for science as well.

I think they can intersect. Magick may even have some scientific backing someday if we can ever get to the bottom of magical work and how it works.

Science can look like magick to those who don’t understand. So I think they go to together even though I don’t know exactly how yet.

In my daily life I use science when I cook. I think we use science when creating potions and spell jars.

[georgia]

I wanted to be in awe. Awe is one of the most mind-expanding sensations in existence. You all have done it!

Thank you!

Challenge entry
Trigger warning: death

I remember an experiment, though I’m not sure where I heard about it, wherein scientists wanted to know if anything happened at the moment of death. They knew someone was going to die, so they put the person on a scales. It was their theory that at the moment of death, a body would become lighter, having lost something physical in the process of crossing over. Instead, the body gained weight! Whatever was separated from the physical body was buoyant! As far as I have heard, they still haven’t figured out what that buoyant “thing” was.

Physics has measured the universe and the space between protons, neutrons, and electrons, and has found that one atom contains more energy than the entire universe put together! How is that even possible?

Then there are the reports from the first astronauts that when they looked out into the vast expanse of “nothingness,” they felt like someone was looking back! Who?

In my humble opinion, the unknown is the Magick we witches use every day. Combine that with the laws of physics, which are reworded in almost every culture, and we get an even stronger force than our word “unknown” can identify- a force big enough for us all to enjoy and revel in, something impossible for us humans to understand, exploit, destroy, or ever use up. If we choose to personify that energy, attempt to make it understandable so we can work with it, that is Magick in psychology. When we work with even the tiniest corner of that energy to the best of our understanding to help ourselves and each other, that is Magick in physics. If I seek my place within that vastness and find an atom’s worth of value, that is Magick in philosophy. It all improves life as we know it.

I may be crazy for believing this way. Every belief is valid and valuable in my not so humble opinion; and there is room enough in this universe… and my own little corner of it… for all. I choose to learn from whomever and whatever I can. There are no boundaries!

[Wysteria_Norn]

I love how you wove magick and science together with a miracle

For countless many, science has provided miracles and we can all attest to the miraculous power of magick.

Very nice

[Wysteria_Norn]

After reading your delightful post there’s no reason for you to be humble! Your descriptions of Magick in psychology, physics and philosophy was sheer poetry

Thank you!

[Satans_Helper]

@Wysteria_Norn thankyou for your kind words! Much love to you

@georgia nice mention on the weight of the body after death

[georgia]

@Wysteria_Norn

sheer poetry

And thank you!

I’m glad you enjoyed that. The other posts were a tough act to follow. I was pretty nervous.

[celineelise]

Amazing post! Thank you

[celineelise]

Thank you @Cosmic_Curiosity . Your moon pictures are beautiful

[Kasandra]

Challenge Entry

When I first made the decision to start practicing, in one of Scott Cunningham’s books, he said you shouldn’t force yourself to believe something. Discover the truth for yourself. I had to ask myself the same question. At the time, I hadn’t been a practicing Catholic for 8 years and hadn’t done anything spiritual in almost a decade. There’s no way that magick is real. I thought this because I didn’t have a full understanding what magick is and what it can and cannot do. Science agrees that there are aspects of witchcraft that can be beneficial to your mental and physical health (journaling, meditating, herbal tea, etc). Since then, I have learned that yes, magick is indeed, real, and so are the energies or deities (whatever you prefer to call them) that I work with.

[christine2]

I scrolled down to get more info and noticed your post. This is definitely gonna be a deep dive for me. I’ve taken more written notes and noted questions to research than I have from any other video or segment in previous lessons. If you have begun your deep dive, have you came across any interesting information you’d like to share? I think this is going to lead me to things I’ve already lined up to research such as, magnetic pull, cosmetic changes as it relates to individuals, natural grounding, and rejuvenating through nature. Until this video, I’ve been all over the place with research and learning. I haven’t practiced any of what would be considered as magic and wasn’t gonna start until I found a focus point that stood out for me. Correcting my my personal magnetic field is going to be my start. Based on the info in the video, I feel this is most important because healing my magnetic energy will keep me conscious in doing no harm when practicing.

[georgia]

@christine2

Correcting my my personal magnetic field is going to be my start.

I’m interested in this as well @Artemisia . I get the feeling I goofed things up for myself through mirroring after 50 years of “being good.”

[celineelise]

@Wysteria_Norn

As an aside, there’s a British TV program called Ghosts UK

I haven’t watched the UK version of ghosts. I may need to. I watch the one that is American and it is hilarious.

[TheMuslimWitch]

Challenge Entry: Science and Witchcraft @TheMuslimWitch

For this weeks challenge, i wanted to reflect on what i have learned about science and witchcraft and how the two topics actually do go hand in hand.
So far i have learned that the relationship between magic and science is that they both are about controlling the world around us, however, magic is more about controlling the people around us and science about controlling things. (Source: https://www.quora.com/Are-magic-and-science-related#:~:text=Kind%20of.,way%20that%20they%20don’t.)

Now my thoughts on this was that i do agree to an extent but about the controlling people part does not ring true to me and i focus on more about making an impact on my environment and outcomes rather than physical people or objects.

I have also learned that both magic and science care to offer explanations through general principles that have somewhat consistent internal logic where the principles are applied to specific situations (source: https://www.quora.com/Are-magic-and-science-similar#:~:text=First%2C%20some%20similarities%3A%20both%20science,applicable%20to%20more%20specific%20situations.)

I found that i do agree with this statement also, however for me personally it is not somewhat of the time rather all of the time as my craft is my very soul and if i did not believe in my craft and beliefs fully then to me i could not follow something if i had doubts let alone apply it to everyday life.

[Litha]

Challenge entry

I am a scientist. I worked in research science went to undergraduate and graduate school, have published papers. For the past 25 years I have taught science (secondary and college courses). I see science as the physical world and my magick is my inner energy and spiritual world. It is how I connect with my less “Vulcan” side. Yin and Yang. They both have to be there is no homeostasis.

I know that much of the scientific discovery we have built our civilization upon is rooted in the wisdom of witches, shaman, and healers. I know that science seeks to explain the unknown and that takes away some of what was once magic. But they aren’t opposed. I can explain how plants bend towards light on a biochemical level, but that doesn’t make the leaves turing toward the sun any less magical. It’s how we choose to perceive and interact with the science and the magick.

My practice is heavy on potions and minerals, cooking, glassware and crockery. I aspire to herbalism but get distracted and killl my plants. I approach my spell prep with the same strategy I approach lab prep, except with a deference for the vibrational energy of whatever I am doing. Instead of thinking about chemical properties and contaminants, I consider correspondences and the elements (the ones not on the giant table on my wall). For me there is no science without magic, and my magick doesn’t exist when I ignore my science.

So this week is going to be a strange one for me…Instead of taking any action I am just opening myself up to others integration of magic and science. That sounds like it’s just me lurking in the thread, but I’m having some visceral reactions to the posts (both positive and negative).
I am making a conscious effort to open myself up to new ideas and interpretations and clarify why I am reacting.